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LastLight

ToA Feedback!

124 posts in this topic

@LastLight Which is saying something. Every. Single. Tourney I have attempted to enter has been a colossal shit show. I have backpedaled out of every roster, without fail, because of pissing contests between several others before the stupid thing ever started.

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Posted (edited)

I fully expected there to be this type of discussion in a feedback thread. We said from the start it's a "trial run" sort of deal and we are looking to refine and improve the rules. As long as no one is engaging in personal spats and making nasty remarks to each other and such, which no one has so far, I consider it to be a massive success. Disagreement without incivility I fully encourage. A mindset that all disagreement is by default "drama" is actually highly problematic in my mind, and one source of issues in past competitive settings.

Edited by Robbie Rotten
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I would definitely feel that this ruke set would be a lot more solid if the whole grenade type deal would get nerfed I would feel better about it. It kinda feels redundant to have us be more durable yet to have these passives for more durbility. It sort of feels like a consistency issue with the rules if everything feels really powerful like a grenade, but we are supposed to somehow drag this out to where the matches are stronger. 

I can work with it if you still want to keep it that way, but I feel that if we are going for relative physics then maybe we shouldn't also be throwing around spells capable of one shotting each other can become a real problem, especially if we are to go into this with a mindset of dodging is supposed to be difficult. 

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Posted (edited)

Nm. Misunderstanding on my part.

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited by Ataraxy

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I've caught up on everything! And due to my tardiness, everything I may have thought of to help the situation has been covered. Whoop. Go me.

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I have another thing to bring up.

I understand that you want knock down drag out matches, however , some times fighters put themselves into positions where they logically cannot make another move. Is it safe to assume that any attempt to dodge, no matter how impossible or impractical can be used on the basis of "we don't want one hit it quit it matches". There have been a number of fights that still have yet to be underway and two matches where substitutes have been slotted into rounds for people dropping out.

So my question is, of the fights aren't going to the "tournaments" favor of "no one hit, long drawn out fights, and droppers" are we going to experierience an endless round 1 loop of these things are not met:

example: continuous editations of posts allowing fighters to continuously escape.

I am curious about this, again because logical one shots happen from time to time. (Rogers fight is a good example) so instead of the technical winner advancing we have a bracket shift. Sup with this?

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48 minutes ago, Bardic Knowledge said:

I have another thing to bring up.

I understand that you want knock down drag out matches, however , some times fighters put themselves into positions where they logically cannot make another move. Is it safe to assume that any attempt to dodge, no matter how impossible or impractical can be used on the basis of "we don't want one hit it quit it matches".

This would only be the case if getting hit always results in the match immediately ending. Whereas in actuality one hit KOs are being discouraged. There seems to be a mindset here that you either completely dodge every attack or you immediately lose, which is a black and white fallacy. That's exactly what you wouldn't want to see if you were encouraging fights to have some degree of give and take.

52 minutes ago, Bardic Knowledge said:

I am curious about this, again because logical one shots happen from time to time. (Rogers fight is a good example) so instead of the technical winner advancing we have a bracket shift. Sup with this?

"Roger" is Corban, I believe. In which case, I don't recall there being a one shot knock out in that fight? His opponent just quit the tournament abruptly, he didn't get KO'd IC. I can see why people might want to get an advancement instead of a reassignment in that case, but I think this is why lastlight took down a backup roster during sign ups, to prepare for when people inevitably dropped.

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Posted (edited)

9 minutes ago, Robbie Rotten said:

This would only be the case if getting hit always results in the match immediately ending. Whereas in actuality one hit KOs are being discouraged. There seems to be a mindset here that you either completely dodge every attack or you immediately lose, which is a black and white fallacy. That's exactly what you wouldn't want to see if you were encouraging fights to have some degree of give and take.

"Roger" is Corban, I believe. In which case, I don't recall there being a one shot knock out in that fight? His opponent just quit the tournament abruptly, he didn't get KO'd IC. I can see why people might want to get an advancement instead of a reassignment in that case, but I think this is why lastlight took down a backup roster during sign ups, to prepare for when people inevitably dropped.

So what if you have a drop outside round one?

 

Also, isn't the point to block/defense attacks in order to land your own? I don't understand the logic. 

if two people are in a fist fight, and one takes a punch to the throat or is concussed of course the fight will end, what other outcome is there in a fight? I understand one shots being discouraged but... on the other hand if you take a flat on punch to the throats you aren't going to be doing much fighting after that. So, the question still stands, unanswered.

also, is ever botched dodge/ block attempt going to be subject to constant editing of a post to keep on this "trail of drug out" fighting.

the question at hand: is this a competetive tournament or a story based RP?

Edited by Bardic Knowledge

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12 minutes ago, Bardic Knowledge said:

So what if you have a drop outside round one?

That's a good question. Lastlight should probably answer it. I understand why people would say they should just advance to the second round if their opponent drops.
 

Quote

 

Also, isn't the point to block/defense attacks in order to land your own? I don't understand the logic.

if two people are in a fist fight, and one takes a punch to the throat or is concussed of course the fight will end, what other outcome is there in a fight? I understand one shots being discouraged but... on the other hand if you take a flat on punch to the throats you aren't going to be doing much fighting after that. So, the question still stands, unanswered.

 

You need to clarify your question then, since I have no idea what you're asking.

Quote

also, is ever botched dodge/ block attempt going to be subject to constant editing of a post to keep on this "trail of drug out" fighting.

I don't recall that anyone has been made to edit a post in this manner. The only time that anyone has been forced to edit a post so far, it was actually in the opposite direction (they wrote that they totally avoided an attack, and then had to edit that they took some damage from it after the opponent judge called their post).

Quote

the question at hand: is this a competetive tournament or a story based RP?

I'm not sure why you would ask this unless you're trying to imply that it's a story based RP being advertised as a competitive tournament. In which case, I would note that your idea of competitive may be completely different from mine or Lastlight's. Which is fine, because those differences in values are inevitable, but if you can't reconcile that difference, it's not on the people running the tournament to adjust their interpretations to match those of a participant. It's actually the other way around. If you think the rule set, the way the judges are behaving, etc., just plain sucks, and everything needs to be done the way you would do it or it's "not competitive," I would encourage you to simply not participate.

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1 hour ago, Bardic Knowledge said:

I understand that you want knock down drag out matches, however , some times fighters put themselves into positions where they logically cannot make another move. Is it safe to assume that any attempt to dodge, no matter how impossible or impractical can be used on the basis of "we don't want one hit it quit it matches". There have been a number of fights that still have yet to be underway and two matches where substitutes have been slotted into rounds for people dropping out.

So my question is, of the fights aren't going to the "tournaments" favor of "no one hit, long drawn out fights, and droppers" are we going to experierience an endless round 1 loop of these things are not met:

People have been dropping out, not losing matches. That's why matches have been changed up and fighters have been juggled around into different fights. I asked Roger if he was good with it and he thought it was the sportsmanlike thing to do, to allow himself to enter into another Rd 1 match. I was really happy with that. Anyway, at this point in time, next person who drops will just be allowing the fighter to move to round two. If two fighters drop from different matches, to keep the tournament moving essentially, I might message both of them and ask if they'd like to be put in a fight with the other person who just had a vacancy open up. 

If someone drops outside of round 2, the person advances but again, if two people drop out of round 2 and leave two vacant fights, the two remaining fighters will be asked if they would like to be put together in a fight to keep things moving. 

Also, question, and I think it's good to bring it up here so people can chime in. What's making you feel like your bard can't compete in this tournament? Right now the only example I have is that he can't have his attacks travel at 1116.40 fps but I'm guessing there has to be more. Could you elaborate so we can get some feedback on it and discuss it all around? 

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9 minutes ago, LastLight said:

Also, question, and I think it's good to bring it up here so people can chime in. What's making you feel like your bard can't compete in this tournament? Right now the only example I have is that he can't have his attacks travel at 1116.40 fps but I'm guessing there has to be more. Could you elaborate so we can get some feedback on it and discuss it all around? 

Carrying over what I already said in PM, we should put this in perspective.

This was an instant win attack traveling at nearly four times the velocity limit using 1/2 of a prep.

I think before we give any credence to the idea that the character has been "nerfed to the point of being useless" by not being able to do this, we should ask someone other than Bardic Knowledge whether or not that attack sounds overpowered. Personally, it sounds absurdly overpowered to me, and I consider it quite self-evident that this was going to be asked to be toned down as soon as any judges looked at it.

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@Robbie Rotten

Yeah sounds good. Anyone chiming in would be great. If it was me about to use a light based attack and I knew light travels at 180k+ fps, I'd probably inquire on it but then again I was involved in every rule put into this set so har har. Simon did say he spent days reading the rules though in PM. The rules are pretty big though, so I'm not surprised he missed a few things. 

At this point I've already said I'm going to update the rules to reflect this but opinions on this whole thing are still welcome. 

 

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What was the nature of the attack? I get it was supposed to be very fast, but what was the damage power on the attack? What do you mean by half a prep? We're there any additional effects to the attack?

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Posted (edited)

4 minutes ago, Ataraxy said:

What was the nature of the attack? I get it was supposed to be very fast, but what was the damage power on the attack? What do you mean by half a prep? We're there any additional effects to the attack?

The effect of the attack was to turn up the volume of his instrument and cause acoustic trauma via magical amplifier. 

In layman's terms he plugged a guitar into a magical amp. 

The was no rule regarding the enchantment of items found in physics with magic.

The attack was creating an amplifier with magical power, which followed all the rules in the ToA the attacks EFFECT however, was to ''break it down!" really loudly which is not covered. Somehow the judges of the ToA, after repeated explanation still think the ''attack'' was moving at 1116.44 FPS, when it didn't it moved from finger to string (the amp is the attack) making sound louder (Sound has its own properties not covered in the existing rules at the time)

Edited by Bardic Knowledge

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Posted (edited)

Quote

 

Self Buff, Celestial Heroism 50% increase to Speed, Strength, and Casting Agility (1 turn)

 

 Celestial Dust, Transmuted ½ Prep used to create Dispel magic

 

Quick Draw muffle

 

 Bardic Knowledge

 

Preps gained: 0, Channeling effects of harp music in play.

 

Previous Preps: 1

 

Usable Preps this turn: 1 (Spent)

 

Usable Preps Next Turn: 0, Channeling Song +1

 

Advantages: Speed, strength,clarity buff 2 turns; Self Buff Celestial Heroism 1 turn.

 

Most probable action next turn: Channel, Banshee’s song.

 

Dispel magic explanation: The foot channels magic to the dust, which channels downwards at ½ prep speed (100 fps) this spell is in place like a radio jammer that changes frequency making it near impossible to reach out to the earth in his sphere of influence (downward 3ft.)

 

Banshee’s Song Explanation: ½ prep used to create a magical amplifier, this causes the sound waves from his already playing harp to become loud enough to cause acoustic trauma to the tympanic membrane of the ear. A double rupture (the point of the attack) would render the fighter unable to continue, for reasons I would hope people understand so I don’t have to go into the biological aspect to rupturing two eardrums at once.

 

The speed of sound at sea level is 1116.44 (Rounded) feet per second. Sound traveling through the magical amp created by Maeryn (1/2 prep 100fps from fingertip to string) would have the same property as regular sound, just at a much louder frequency. Since there is no rule on this, the normal rule of PHYSICS must apply to said sound.  The sound applied by the harp does not affect the caster due to the muffle quick draw.

 

Given the speed of sound is 1116.44 FPS, and even calculating for a drop off of half or even quarter of that speed gives the peace keeper little time to dodge at the 30 ft distance.

 

The way the sound is designed is for an instant burst, not an effect over time. The effect over time channel, is used to increase the frequency for the next attack.

 

Note, that the effects of Dispel magic, and Banshee’s song are simultaneous meaning they happen at the same time, the QD muffle takes place just before both are applied.

 

 

Bolded relevant sections. @Ataraxy

Edited by Robbie Rotten

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